MLB.com's top 5 Lineups [Archive]

SectionBNole

03-05-2007, 02:58 PM

Any manager will tell you it takes 25 men (and sometimes more) to win a championship, but what if the top prize went to the best starting lineup? Which team would finish on top if the race went to the best starting eight?

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20070305&content_id=1827802&vkey=spt2007news&fext=.jsp

the fluffer

03-05-2007, 03:16 PM

fquaye14ten

03-05-2007, 03:28 PM

the fluffer

03-05-2007, 04:09 PM

eh.

indians have the best lineup in baseball. period.

anyone who disagrees really doesn't know much about baseball.

detroit could have been mentioned.

we could have been mentioned.

the cubs? the yankees? excuse me while i yawn

You're fucking joking right?

I guess I dont know much about baseball. Travis Hafner, Grady Sizemore, Victor Martinez + a bunch of platoons and rookies makes the best lineup?

Hafner (while a beast of a man) still has yet to complete a full season with more than 480 ABs. Victor Martinez is no more than a 280/18/90 defensive liability - most of his RBIs since 2005 resulting from Grady Sizemore being on base... Put Sizemore in the leadoff spot for the Sox, and JD, PK, Thome & Crede would easily each have 10-15 more RBIs. Sizemore and Hafner?? Yea, they're scary. The rest are MLB average at their positions, espcially considering that Martinez hits 5th in their "best MLB lineup ever" where as the Sox have MVP candidates in the 3-5 spots.... also not to mention Iguchi, AJ & Crede. *purposely omits Podsednik, Uribe and Anderson*

Garko & Marte have proven nothing yet. Peralta was a one year wonder. Delucci is a platoon guy (with Michaels) who will be over-exposed playing everyday. Nixon is has watched his average drop 47 points in 3 years (we need a homefish graph).

Anyway, if you think the Indians lineup is the best in baseball, your fucking crazy. So... CW, you better not piss me off and respond to this rip until at least 10pm tonight. I'm going out boozing and womanizing tonight and won't be able to respond until later, so hold off on your self-righteousness-to-counter-my-self-righteousness until later tonight, ok??? Or else I'm shutting your ass down on the free Slayer.

SectionBNole

03-05-2007, 04:22 PM

Victor Martinez is an excellent hitting catcher. You forgot to mention Jhonny Peralta who can be pretty dangerous. Casey Blake provided 19 big flies last season. While it may not be the best lineup in baseball, its certainly one of the better ones.

maurice

03-05-2007, 04:25 PM

Victor Martinez is an excellent hitting catcher.

That's very liberal use of the word "catcher."

SectionBNole

03-05-2007, 04:29 PM

True enough, I have a tendency for over-estimating other teams. :shrug:

soxwon

03-05-2007, 05:07 PM

its amazing that the Sox aren't listed. NO FUCKING RESPECT.

Jermaine Dye
Jim Thome
Paul Konerko
Joe Crede
AJ Pierzynski
Tad Iguchi

That's a lot scarier than the Phillies or Boston. Sox lineup is a lot more balanced. Boston and Phillie are really heavy on the middle. Our #7 hitter is a 285/30/100 guy. I mean, c'mon assclown MLB writers... open your eyes.

i know it, you know it.
we easily have the best 9 players in any one lineup.
dont let it bother you-we dont get respected.
we are the best- end of story screw em i say

fquaye14ten

03-05-2007, 05:59 PM

You're fucking joking right?

I said it like an asshole on purpose.

No counter argument, just some #'s:

OPS+'s among starters:

124
128
97
79
85
78
135
117
183

2006 White Sox starters:

95
135
97
108
74
76
65
152
156

clearly it's a tossup and also clearly i am an asshole, but nevertheless you got my point:D

Efilnikufesin

03-05-2007, 10:04 PM

eh.

indians have the best lineup in baseball. period.

anyone who disagrees really doesn't know much about baseball.

detroit could have been mentioned.

we could have been mentioned.

the cubs? the yankees? excuse me while i yawn

Umm yeah.. I would take the Yankees over the Engines any day of the week.. Reason is simple I watch as they make a pitcher work.. they don't go after crap.. I watch as Bobby A had a 7/9/6 pitch abs That is an Inning worth of pitches thrown over the course of a game just on one guy.

Also The reason the White Sox are not in it.. You have to take Thome out it states that the DH is not an option

Lucifer

03-05-2007, 10:07 PM

eh.

anyone who disagrees really doesn't know much about baseball.

I think the Injuns line-up is bad-ass but......

Anyone who makes a dumb comment like this doesnt know much about anything!:rock:

Efilnikufesin

03-05-2007, 10:11 PM

I think the Injuns line-up is bad-ass but......

Anyone who makes a dumb comment like this doesnt know much about anything!:rock:

I think they have the potenaly to be great. They are good.. just not to the Yankees standards yet.

Lucifer

03-05-2007, 10:16 PM

I think they have the potenaly to be great. They are good.. just not to the Yankees standards yet.

I agree. Give them a few more years when Barfield, Marte and Peralta have gotten better with the bat and yes I could see but looking at the Yanks line-up.......... Sorry Tribe, at the very best they are a brides maide. Just not there yet. There offense was inconsistant last year and they were known for it. They should continue to improve.:thumbsup:

SoxFan76

03-05-2007, 11:02 PM

Lucifer

03-05-2007, 11:20 PM

The Cubs? Man...

I'm not sayin the Sox should be #1, but not even top 5? They had the best trio in baseball last year with Dye, Thome and Konerko. Wait, then there's Iguchi in front. Wait, then there's Crede and Pierzynski behind them. Let's not forget that all SIX of these men batted one after the other! Uribe always has a possibility of going yard, Podsednik is a tough out (considering how many outs he provides, at least they're tough outs), and Anderson...well, he can play defense!

I can't say much more without repeating what's already been said, so I'll leave it at...

White Sox offense: fuckin studly.

I think what hurt us was not being consistant enuff. I agree we have we have a great Offense but we could be better if BA starts hitting to his potential, Uribe hits like used too and Pods stay healthy so he can continue to hit. If those three things happen we would have to be a top 3 offensive team. #'s 8-9-1 killed us last year.

SoxFan76

03-06-2007, 01:12 AM

I think what hurt us was not being consistant enuff. I agree we have we have a great Offense but we could be better if BA starts hitting to his potential, Uribe hits like used too and Pods stay healthy so he can continue to hit. If those three things happen we would have to be a top 3 offensive team. #'s 8-9-1 killed us last year.

Agreed, but not even top 5?!

I don't know, I haven't really compared the 8-9-1 of the teams listed due to lack of time right now (week before spring break), but maybe tomorrow I'll check it out.

fquaye14ten

03-06-2007, 01:48 AM

Umm yeah.. I would take the Yankees over the Engines any day of the week.. Reason is simple I watch as they make a pitcher work.. they don't go after crap.. I watch as Bobby A had a 7/9/6 pitch abs That is an Inning worth of pitches thrown over the course of a game just on one guy.

Also The reason the White Sox are not in it.. You have to take Thome out it states that the DH is not an option

Hafner is a better count worker than anyone in baseball for the simple fact that...well, he's the best hitter in baseball....

ops+ of 180? that's insane. that's walks and hits man

fquaye14ten

03-06-2007, 01:48 AM

I think the Injuns line-up is bad-ass but......

Anyone who makes a dumb comment like this doesnt know much about anything!:rock:

i was...kidding

halfway....the jndjans are sick

Lucifer

03-06-2007, 05:46 AM

Hafner is a better count worker than anyone in baseball for the simple fact that...well, he's the best hitter in baseball....

ops+ of 180? that's insane. that's walks and hits man
I agree that Hafner is a beast and then some but he is only one hitter out of 9 in the lineup. Peralta's bat has yet to come around and Marte just finished his first full season not to mension they didnt get alot of production out of the second baseman last year either.

This is why their offense was inconsistant last year just like the Sox.

Efilnikufesin

03-06-2007, 06:35 AM

Hafner is a better count worker than anyone in baseball for the simple fact that...well, he's the best hitter in baseball....

ops+ of 180? that's insane. that's walks and hits man

Being the best hitter and better count worker are not the same thing. Haffy is good, but I have no idea how you can call him the best hitter.. That is just insane, I can think of at least 5 people off the top of my head that are better..

Even still this is about the best lineup.. My example was just a small dose of how the Yankees are a better overall lineup. In the NL park Haffy sits.. Hense a problem. Overall the Yankees have at least 5-6 guys that are like Bobby.. While the Engines only have Haff.

StockdaleforVeep

03-06-2007, 06:40 AM

http://graphics.boston.com/images/bostondirtdogs//Headline_Archives/BDD_PG_hot_stove.jpg
"People dont realize they need to just listen to me. I am so awesome i had a brain aneurysm because of my awesomeness."

fquaye14ten

03-06-2007, 09:11 AM

Being the best hitter and better count worker are not the same thing. Haffy is good, but I have no idea how you can call him the best hitter.. That is just insane, I can think of at least 5 people off the top of my head that are better..

Even still this is about the best lineup.. My example was just a small dose of how the Yankees are a better overall lineup. In the NL park Haffy sits.. Hense a problem. Overall the Yankees have at least 5-6 guys that are like Bobby.. While the Engines only have Haff.

First of all, Hafner walks as much as anyone in baseball.

Second, most metrics show Hafner to be the best hitter in baseball. Who's better? Perhaps Pujols and Howard. Perhaps Manny. But their #'s don't hold up.

Hafner 06:

OPS=1.096
HR=42
RBI=117
BB=100
OBP=.439
OPS+=183

Howard 06 (playing in the national league):
OPS=1.084
HR=58
RBI=149
BB=108
OBP=.425
OPS+=170

Pujols 06 (playing in the national league):
OPS=1.101
HR=49
RBI=137
BB=92
OBP=.431
OPS+=180

Ortiz 06:
OPS=1.049
HR=54
RBI=137
BB=119
OBP=.413
OPS+=164

MVP Justin Morneau:
OPS=.934
HR=34
RBI=130
BB=53
OBP=.375
OPS+=140

or how about eqa's?

1. DH Travis Hafner .355
2. LF Manny Ramirez .342
3. DH David Ortiz .334
4. DH Jim Thome .328
5. DH Jason Giambi .326
6. C Joe Mauer .321
7. RF Jermaine Dye .320
8. SS Derek Jeter .316
9. RF Vladimir Guerrero .314
10. 3B Alex Rodriguez .311

ALBERT PUJOLS 0.346
RYAN HOWARD 0.337
BARRY BONDS 0.335
MIGUEL CABRERA 0.333

He's also only 6 points behind Howard, the league leader in VORP, which, considering Hafner plays DH exclusively speaks voluminously to his hitting abilities

fquaye14ten

03-06-2007, 09:12 AM

also remember in 05 when Hafner went big fly walkoff like 3 games in a row against us? that shit was terrifying.

So furthermore, Hafner is incredibly clutch (and ozzie is silly for pitching to him)

Efilnikufesin

03-06-2007, 09:39 AM

also remember in 05 when Hafner went big fly walkoff like 3 games in a row against us? that shit was terrifying.

So furthermore, Hafner is incredibly clutch (and ozzie is silly for pitching to him)

Also remember this is best lineup not fquaye14ten's Man crush. :D

fquaye14ten

03-06-2007, 10:04 AM

eh, travis hafner is a scary looking human being. if anything my mancrush is on buehrle.

but honestly, i would put the indians up against every team in baseball, and come away with the idea that the indians are the better lineup. yes, the yankees have a nice sounding lineup, and the middle can mash, but pretty much everyone in the indians lineup can hit except boone, and boone's shown he's capable of putting up good numbers

Efilnikufesin

03-06-2007, 10:24 AM

Huh? Engines vs the Spankies?

If you go by positions

C- Engines
1b- Yankees
2b- Yankees
SS- Yankees
3b- Yankees
LF- Yankees
CF- Engines
RF- Yankees
DH- Tie, but for the sake of not arguing over a single player Engines.

Yeah, I can see where your point is valid..:omg:

Also Boone, doesn't play for them anymore.. That would be One Andy Marte, who they acquired in the Coco Crisp deal.

Lucifer

03-06-2007, 10:37 AM

Right on and Peralta is no Jeter either.:thumbsup:

Efilnikufesin

03-06-2007, 10:38 AM

Right on and Peralta is no Jeter either.:thumbsup:

But he had that one season where he hit 24hr.. so that must equate to being better than Jeter right?

fquaye14ten

03-06-2007, 10:39 AM

ugh---you're arguing the name recognition factor...

i also find it humorous you value damon over sizemore

fquaye14ten

03-06-2007, 10:40 AM

and apparently we have to twist your arm to say hafner over giambi? what possible argument could you make for giambi.

i'm too hungover for this.

Efilnikufesin

03-06-2007, 10:42 AM

and apparently we have to twist your arm to say hafner over giambi? what possible argument could you make for giambi.

i'm too hungover for this.

Good thing we don't have to.. Since Giambi is their 1b..

Edit: I stand corrected I forgot they inked DougM.. So in that case Your Man Crush is better than RiodAmbi.

Efilnikufesin

03-06-2007, 10:44 AM

ugh---you're arguing the name recognition factor...

i also find it humorous you value damon over sizemore

actually over play..

Really, I don't see it that way. I would take Sizemore each and every time.

fquaye14ten

03-06-2007, 11:18 AM

ah i misread your list.

whatever. let's agree to disagree. neither team will make the playoffs this year, imo

fquaye14ten

03-06-2007, 11:18 AM

Good thing we don't have to.. Since Giambi is their 1b..

Edit: I stand corrected I forgot they inked DougM.. So in that case Your Man Crush is better than RiodAmbi.

i have no man crush on any non white sox.

maybe pujols, but that's it.

find another way to try to insult me:rolleyes:

Hangar18

03-06-2007, 11:19 AM

also remember in 05 when Hafner went big fly walkoff like 3 games in a row against us? that shit was terrifying.

So furthermore, Hafner is incredibly clutch (and ozzie is silly for pitching to him)

I agree. Late innings ..........men on. you DONT pitch to Hafner

Efilnikufesin

03-06-2007, 11:26 AM

find another way to try to insult me:rolleyes:

You do a fine job of that by yourself.. No need of my help.

And The Yankees will make the playoffs.. And they are the better lineup.

Efilnikufesin

03-06-2007, 11:27 AM

I agree. Late innings ..........men on. you DONT pitch to Hafner

There is allot of hitter that are like that..Howard, Oritz, Dye, Albert, Crede.. just to name a few.

fquaye14ten

03-06-2007, 11:28 AM

You do a fine job of that by yourself.. No need of my help.

And The Yankees will make the playoffs.. And they are the better lineup.

well that was a fun experiment. fool me three times....:shrug:

back on ignore:rolleyes:

Hangar18

03-06-2007, 11:29 AM

Whats funny about this list, is the top 3 features teams that Ran out and BOUGHT THEIR PLAYERS, that is, a whopping majority are players they didnt draft. They Yankees and Cubs simply have all-star teams out there. The team that impresses in their top 5?

The Phillies.

Efilnikufesin

03-06-2007, 11:30 AM

Who did the Mets other than Beltran go out and buy.. That is in their lineup?

Reyes and Wright are home grown
Delgado, Loduca and Green are trades.
Alou is a wash he be hurt by June.

Efilnikufesin

03-06-2007, 11:34 AM

Also the Same thing can be said about the Yankees.
Cano, Posada, and Jeter Are home grown
A-rod, Abreau are trades
Matsui Damon and Giambi are the only ones they spent cash on.

the fluffer

03-06-2007, 12:38 PM

Also the Same thing can be said about the Yankees.
Cano, Posada, and Jeter Are home grown
A-rod, Abreau are trades
Matsui Damon and Giambi are the only ones they spent cash on.

The Yankees' entire rotation with the exception of Wang, is made up of free agent signings. Pavano, Pettite, Mussina, Igawa.

Their bullpen is made up of Rivera and a bunch of free agent signings and guys they received when trading away bust free agent signings. Myers, Vizcaino, Farnsworth, Britton.

Don't forget the Yankees spent the last two seasons trading away big signings of the last 5 years. Wright, Johnson, Sheffield, etc....

the fluffer

03-06-2007, 12:44 PM

Who did the Mets other than Beltran go out and buy.. That is in their lineup?

Reyes and Wright are home grown
Delgado, Loduca and Green are trades.
Alou is a wash he be hurt by June.

Again, the Mets pitching staff isn't a product of prospects or the draft. It's a collection of guys that resulted in signings or trades of big ticket signings.

Free agent signings: Pedro, Gravine, Chan Ho Park
Trades: El Duque (Jorge Julio, was was in the Benson trade), Maine (Benson trade), Oliver Perez (Nady who was a part of the Mike Cameron trade)

Bullpen: Mota, Sosa, Schoeneweis and Billy fucking Wagner

Efilnikufesin

03-06-2007, 12:45 PM

The Yankees' entire rotation with the exception of Wang, is made up of free agent signings. Pavano, Pettite, Mussina, Igawa.

Their bullpen is made up of Rivera and a bunch of free agent signings and guys they received when trading away bust free agent signings. Myers, Vizcaino, Farnsworth, Britton.

Don't forget the Yankees spent the last two seasons trading away big signings of the last 5 years. Wright, Johnson, Sheffield, etc....

What does their rotation and bullpen have to with the topic, of which team has the best lineup?

Randy Johnson was a trade.. How do you think we acquired Javier?

the fluffer

03-06-2007, 12:58 PM

What does their rotation and bullpen have to with the topic, of which team has the best lineup?

Randy Johnson was a trade.. How do you think we acquired Javier?

Well no shit, Sherlock. BUT, the Sox acquired Vazquez with their top position prospect - that THEY drafted and they developed.

The object of the Sox minor league system is to A) develop players to impact the major league roster and B) to develop players to use in acquiring major league players.

Look at the Sox rotation, bullpen and everyday starters. the vast majority were either drafted by the Sox, were acquired in trades for Sox prospects, or were acquired in trades for players the Sox originally acquired with prospects.

Floyd for Garcia from Olivo/Reed
Masset/Danks from McCarthy
Thome from Rowand/Haigwood/Gio
etc, etc...

Dye, AJ and Iguchi are the only 3 position players not drafted by the Sox or that were acquired by trading a player the Sox drafted.

Your previous posts were based on the argument that the Mets and Yankees haven't "purchased" their rosters, which couldn't be further from the truth.

BTW - Trivium is the Wham! of metal. Brokeback.

Efilnikufesin

03-06-2007, 01:09 PM

Your previous posts were based on the argument that the Mets and Yankees haven't "purchased" their rosters, which couldn't be further from the truth.

BTW - Trivium is the Wham! of metal. Brokeback.

Where in any of my posts did I say their pitching staff? Please show me..Again this is a thread about lineups.. I Know all about their pitching staffs... please do stay with the program.

What does my music taste have to do with the lineups?

the fluffer

03-06-2007, 01:14 PM

Where in any of my posts did I say their pitching staff? Please show me..Again this is a thread about lineups.. I Know all about their pitching staffs... please do stay with the program.

What does my music taste have to do with the lineups?

Who gives a crap if the thread title is lineups... the point is, the Mets and Yankees DID buy their rosters. Almost all of the players they acquired in trades, oh... THEIR OFFENSIVE PLAYERS... they acquired in salary dumps by the Phillies and Marlins - absorbing the entire contract.

Stay with the program? Ugh. :jagoff: I'm with Fquaye. You just don't get it.

Where's the fucking ignore button?

Efilnikufesin

03-06-2007, 01:19 PM

Who gives a crap if the thread title is lineups... the point is, the Mets and Yankees DID buy their rosters. Almost all of the players they acquired in trades, oh... THEIR OFFENSIVE PLAYERS... they acquired in salary dumps by the Phillies and Marlins - absorbing the entire contract.

Stay with the program? Ugh. :jagoff: I'm with Fquaye. You just don't get it.

Where's the fucking ignore button?

:rolleyes: Yeah I'm the one that doesn't get it.

Lucifer

03-06-2007, 01:51 PM

Im trying to understand what this whole arguement is about. Every team makes trades for players and signs free agents. Granted some more than other but it is still done regardless so whats the big deal?

Efilnikufesin

03-06-2007, 02:28 PM

I'm trying to figure out Lucifer is how this turned into I hate the Yankees/NY thread.

Lucifer

03-06-2007, 03:05 PM

I'm trying to figure out Lucifer is how this turned into I hate the Yankees/NY thread.

It certainly appears as though thats the case. I hate em too but thats besides the point here. The Sox have done the same shit as the Yanks and everyone else too. Heres the way I see it....... On our current bench and lineup only BA and Crede are home grown and the rest came here through F/A and trades. As for our pitchers.... Buehrle is the only one thats home grown and the rest came from F/A and trades.

To be honest we have done the same shit as the Yanks and alot of other clubs so whats the big deal?:shrug: